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I have, like most men diagnosed with prostate cancer spent a great deal of time on the internet reading articles and study results in regard to prostate cancer. My delving into this subject has revealed some interesting stuff which I would like to present here in the lounge. The following information is of interest to me as it relates to the use and theory of ADTusage in advanced PC where the goal is to stop testosterone production in men. 


I would appreciate any feedback from members and so I offer the following information for anyone who may be interested. Please note that I am not presenting this information as a personal opinion of fact but as a subject of interest only, as I too am not a doctor.


My readings tell me that:


Hormone balance in men and women is critical for optimum health and both men and women share three main hormones in differing quantities. Testosterone, (men)Progesterone, (the balancer) and Estrogen (female). It has long been known that an excess or imbalance of estrogen can cause breast cancer in women, however consider the following argument in the case of prostate cancer.


Prostate cancer occurs mostly in older men with low levels of testosterone and low levels of progesterone, estrogen levels in the form of estadiol1 rise and dominate in older men. The estrogen increases in the fat of overweight older men by the conversion of testosterone into the estrogens. Life style contributes to the manufacture of estrogens in men by the over use of alchohol, smoking, diet, pollution, the use of plastics for cooking and drinking and shift work. (sleep disturbance patterns)


So are we on the right track in our fight against prostate cancer??????? There is a surprising amount of studies and information available on the role of estrogen in prostate cancer and further research is happening but you really have to go looking for it.


It appears to me that there is not much difference between men and women just a different percentage of the same hormones. I think the Chinese hit the nail on the head with the concept of Yin and Yang. Same with the hormones Yin and Yang and is progesterone the juggler???? And is it really estrogen that is the culprit in prostate cancer?????


Lee aka Popeye


Further Reading        



http://www.organicsilica.biz/research/8006.pdf  (*** Dr John Lee booklet "Hormone Balance for men.)





















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Guest tonybrown

Hi popeye,  I am surprised at the literature you have collected on estrogen.  My experience is I had ADT for 2 years after brachy & HDBR & have been off Zoladex for approx 2 years.  So far my psa remains very low.   After about a year my testosterone roared back & then I had painfull gland swelling in my nipples & enlarging breasts after my testosterone came back!   The explanation was I had high estrogen levels at the same time.  Apparently estrogen is a breakdown product of testosteone as some of your articles discussed.  I found an article about body builders who if they overdose on testosterone injections can end up with breast enlargement due to high levels of estrogen.  Not what these guys had in mind!    I have been consoling myself in the beleif that this is probably giving me some protection from cancer  but your articles caste another complection.   Anyway after putting up with this for perhaps 15 months I suddenly realised recently the pain had subsided to the point it was no longer a problem.   So time for another blood test to see what is going on. It is amazing sometimes how slowly the body adjusts to changes like hormone balances.     Just reading your articles it seems to suggest estrogen can suppress some prostate cancer types but impact adversly on  others. 

I certainly am interested in  how these hormones interact & how they effect prostate cancer.   Estogen appears also to be the main hormone in bone building - not testosterone as some literature seems to suggest.  it is the association of testosterone with estrogen that causes the confusion.    That is anothe risk with ADT - bone density loss.  Are you monitoring this?   


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Tony: Thanks for your input. In two weeks time I will have been on ADT for 12 months (Eligard) and have not had a bone density test done at this stage. Perhaps it is still early days for me on ADT as the doctors have not suggested a test at this time. I will be continuing on ADT for at least the next 12 months and then I will be reviewed. I only completed my IMRT course just prior to last Christmas so I am still a new kid on the block.


My interest in hormone balance in men is the result of a friend of mine with advanced PC who passed away from his disease last September. He swore by the use of progesterone cream he used to alleviate symptoms he experienced with his PC over the years. At the time he was not on ADT and was receiving palliative pain control only. My friend claimed the progesterone was the balancer between the testosterone and the estrogens and made him more comfortable as the disease progressed. Hence I have been off in the internett searching for extra knowledge if it exists. I have not located any discussion in this subject in any of the forum stuff here or elswhere for that matter so I decided to throw the issue out there for feedback.




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Hi Popeye


              I had to firmly suggest a bone density test to my Doctor and Oncologist. I have been on Eligard, continuous, for two years in April (next month).I had been on ADT six months when I had my first bone density check.


For me I needed a reference point to know what the bone density was near the commencement of ADT. This is to see what effect the Hormone Therapy may have over the years. If left too long it may be harder to determine if Eligard is the cause of deterioration and having an effect or if you had an issue you were not aware of to start with.

This is my body and I have a vested interest in what is going on. It is quick and easy to have done and one thing less to worry about.






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Thanks Nev for your input. I had not considered a bone density test as a base line reference point although I should have as I recommend to my friends to get a PSA done for a baseline.

I guess I put too much faith in my doctors as they have never suggested it to me so I assumed it was not a priority. However I will be asking the question on this issue at my next appointments and will let you know the outcome.


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Skin patches 'tackle prostate cancer'

By James Gallagher

Health and science reporter, BBC News



Skin patches which deliver oestrogen into the blood may be a cheaper and safer treatment for prostate cancer than current therapies, a study says.


The main treatment is injections of a chemical to cut levels of testosterone - the driving force of many prostate cancers - but it causes side effects.


The Imperial College London study in the Lancet Oncology compared patches and injections in 254 patients.


It found patches were safe and should avoid menopause-like side effects.


'Effective treatments'

Using oestrogen to treat prostate cancer is an old treatment.


Both oestrogen and testosterone are very similar chemically, so ramping up the levels of oestrogen in the body can reduce the amount of testosterone produced - and slow prostate cancer growth.


However, taking oral oestrogen pills caused significant health problems by overdosing the liver. The organ then produced chemicals which caused blood clots, heart attacks and strokes.


The preferred treatment is injections of a drug, LHRHa, which reduces the production of both oestrogen and testosterone. However, this has side effects similar to the menopause in women - resulting in poor bone health and diabetes.



The patch releases oestrogen through the skin

Prof Paul Abel, from Imperial College London, said: "We're not claiming this is equivalent to current therapies yet, but it does look like we are getting castration levels of testosterone."


However, the researchers need to follow patients for longer.


"The next step is to test if the oestrogen patches are as effective at stopping the growth of prostate cancer as the current hormone treatments, we're now testing this in over 600 patients."


Kate Law, from the charity Cancer Research UK which part funded the study, said: "More men than ever are surviving prostate cancer thanks to advances in research, but we still urgently need to find more effective treatments and reduce side effects.


"This trial is an important step towards better and kinder treatments that could bring big benefits to men with prostate cancer in the future."


Dr Iain Frame, director of research at Prostate Cancer UK, said: "It is unclear as yet if hormone patches could be an effective alternative to hormone injections, but we await with anticipation the results of the further trials planned which could in time offer men hope for the future."
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  • 3 weeks later...

I note that Dr 'Snuffy' Myers uses low dose estrodial patches in his practice to reduce the side effects of ADT, including bone loss, but as yet I have not seen any clinical trial data, nor heard of its use in Australia. Dr Huggins was using Estrogen in his early experiments into hormone therapy in the 40s & 50s, prior to being named as Time Magazines (Man? Researcher? ) of the year in the early 60s. However, from memory, as a lot of his work not only involved removal of the testes, but also the adrenal glands, I think most of us can remain thankful for the modern delivery systems of ADT.

I can only echo Nevs recommendation for a bone density scan ASAP, and wish in retrospect I had got one at the start to provide a baseline at that point, as part of the results are referenced against a healthy young adult. Perhaps we should all give some thought to a "SO YOU'RE NEW HERE" section, with a list of questions for the treatment team and the reasons why we think you should ask them, emphasising that we are not doctors, just those already on the same road.


"Your Doctors may have a different agenda to yours" (Snuffy Myers)

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